Vancouver’s Mayor, Ken Sim, is a real Bitcoin fanatic who’s doing his half to get Vancouver’s metropolis council in addition to its residents to see what he sees relating to Bitcoin.
And his efforts are beginning to bear fruit.
On December 11, 2024, the Vancouver City Council greenlit a motion Mayor Sim ready to begin making Vancouver a extra Bitcoin-friendly metropolis.
The movement directs metropolis workers to discover the concepts of Vancouver establishing a strategic bitcoin reserve in addition to accepting taxes and metropolis charges in bitcoin.
In my dialog with Mayor Sim, we mentioned the passing of this movement in addition to a few of his deeper philosophical ideas about Bitcoin.
We additionally touched on what Bitcoin adoption in Vancouver would appear to be in an ideal world, his personal journey down the proverbial Bitcoin rabbit gap and why Bitcoin can convey monetary hope to the residents of Vancouver at a time limit when many are struggling to make ends meet.
The Vancouver Metropolis Council not too long ago handed your movement to make Vancouver a extra Bitcoin-friendly metropolis.
On a private stage, although, should you might wave a magic wand and allow no matter stage of Bitcoin adoption you see slot in Vancouver, what would that appear to be?
I’ve obtained to provide you a caveat right here. These are my very own private views. We’ve a reasonably unbelievable workforce on the Metropolis of Vancouver, they usually’ve been tasked to discover. So, it isn’t as if I can actually affect the workforce and inform them “You need to do that and that.”
In an ideal world, the very first thing we’d do is add to a strategic reserve. The second factor could be permitting individuals to transact with bitcoin with out triggering capital features tax occasions and to just accept funds within the type of bitcoin. Tax regulation throughout not simply Canada, however within the U.S. and a number of different jurisdictions, nonetheless hasn’t caught up, so each time you transact with bitcoin, there’s a capital features tax charge, which could be very cumbersome.
The third factor is that we begin the dialog and we bust the myths round narratives like Bitcoin is dangerous for the setting. That is all hogwash, proper? Bitcoin is definitely going to assist us save the setting.
Plus, it supplies us with an immutable document and it really provides to a stage of transparency we have by no means seen within the historical past of humankind. Having that included into our methods could be nice.
You spoke about this course of of training individuals about Bitcoin on Natalie Brunell’s present. You stated you “bathe them with love and you then hit them with details.” Are you able to give an instance of what this seems to be like?
There’s a number of resistance with Bitcoin, particularly because it pertains to its perceived results on the setting. Individuals hear this narrative that it is dangerous for the setting, and it is like, “Nicely, wait a second…”
I am an environmentalist, and I do know that should you pressure organizations throughout the planet to do stuff that they don’t seem to be incentivized to do, nothing’s going to occur. Whereas should you incentivize them — should you construct in a reward system — it’s wonderful.
So, what do we all know? Nicely, we flare pure fuel as a by-product of oil manufacturing, and if we really seize that and repurpose it for Bitcoin mining, it’s really good for the setting. Identical with capturing methane that seeps from the bottom.
Additionally, with different or inexperienced power sources, be it wind energy or solar energy, the place the economics usually do not pan out to construct these initiatives, you present somebody with a assured buyer within the type of Bitcoin miners, and the economics work and this stuff get constructed. So, it is web optimistic for the setting.
There’s additionally this false narrative that nefarious issues occur with Bitcoin. That is rubbish, proper? Money is untraceable. With Bitcoin, we’re speaking about an immutable document the place you possibly can see each single transaction because the starting of time and you’ll catch individuals on the on and off ramps.
A number of the narratives are literally the exact opposite of actuality, and so we’ve to counter these narratives.
Primarily based on my expertise, it is easy to show somebody one thing, whereas it is lots tougher for individuals to unlearn, and we’re within the technique of serving to individuals unlearn what they’ve realized.
You might have referred to Bitcoin as the best invention in human historical past. Might you broaden on that?
Our cash is damaged. Individuals cannot use it to retailer their power into the longer term. We’re on this rinse and repeat cycle. In Ray Dalio’s ebook The Altering World Order, he talks concerning the rise and fall of the Dutch empire, the rise and fall of the British empire, the rise and, as he places it, fall of the U.S. empire. In the event you agree with Dalio’s perspective, the purpose is that the cash’s damaged.
We should not have a reserve foreign money that is ever lasted. We maintain repeating historical past. However Bitcoin adjustments all that. As everyone knows, you possibly can’t mess with it, and you’ll’t manipulate it. It is a game-changer and after we lastly get onto the bitcoin customary — I feel it is a matter of when, not if — it should change how people work together with one another and the way nation states evolve.
You simply cited one among Ray Dalio’s books, and I’ve heard you talk about the way you’ve additionally learn books like The Bitcoin Customary and Layered Cash. You’re additionally a pal of Jeff Sales space’s. With all of the studying you’ve executed and the conversations you’ve had with Jeff, did you find yourself having a lightbulb second with Bitcoin or was it extra of a gradual studying course of?
Nicely, I had the other of the lightbulb second when my son Mitchell got here as much as me and stated “Dad, I wish to purchase bitcoin.” And I used to be like, “You contact that shit, and I’ll punch you within the throat.” Clearly, I wasn’t going to do this.
Then, I began seeing extra of it and had conversations with Jeff. So, I began to look into it, learn a bunch about it and went to a few conferences. My journey was similar to a number of different individuals’s. I used to be utterly towards it after which I warmed as much as it and ultimately turned an evangelist.
I can not level to anyone level the place it was like, “Wow, there you go” and I went 180 levels the opposite manner. I do bear in mind although, I made my first $500 buy of bitcoin on November the 14th, 2020. The rationale it took me so lengthy was I needed to learn to use the app on which I purchased the bitcoin. It was all clunky — only a ache within the butt.
However I do not forget that day, as a result of once I lastly purchased it I assumed, “Did I miss out?” I feel I purchased it at like 16 or 17 grand and it had run from like seven or eight grand the month earlier than. I used to be like, “Did I miss it?” I bear in mind Jeff saying, “No, you’re nonetheless tremendous early; we’re all nonetheless tremendous early.”
You’ve talked about how unaffordable housing in Vancouver is. Does bitcoin repair this?
Sure. Let me provide you with an instance. We’ve a small studio rental up in Whistler (a city north of Vancouver). After we purchased it, it might have price 17.2 bitcoin. That is about 4 years in the past. When it comes to {dollars}, the property is up 36%, however by way of bitcoin, it is down one thing like 85%. As of at this time, it prices like 3.3 bitcoin to purchase it.
By the way in which, I am not giving funding recommendation. I am simply speaking a few theoretical, if this performs out the way it might. If sooner or later within the not so distant future, you can purchase a home in Vancouver for a bitcoin, what meaning is you possibly can actually purchase a home for about US$106,000 or about CA$150,000 should you purchased a bitcoin at this time.
I am not telling individuals to take out a mortgage to purchase bitcoin — very removed from it. Go search monetary recommendation. However should you imagine bitcoin’s value will proceed to understand, you possibly can actually purchase a home for CA$150,000 within the close to future by shopping for a bitcoin proper now.
You’ve got introduced Bitcoin, a taboo topic, into the fold as Mayor of Vancouver, and also you’ve stated that doing so may result in your not getting re-elected. Have you ever ever thought-about that the other is perhaps true, that possibly by embracing Bitcoin the individuals of Vancouver will wish to re-elect you?
I am not too involved about that. I’ve no want to be a premier or prime minister. I am not a politician, despite the fact that I am sitting on this position, which I actually honor, worth and take very severely. However the objective was by no means to be widespread. The objective was by no means to get re-elected. The objective was to do what I believed is correct for the way forward for the Metropolis of Vancouver.
And so I could not sit again any longer and ignore this as a result of I actually imagine that this units the town up for the subsequent hundred years. Am I proper? We do not know, however we’ve a reasonably good feeling, and I actually imagine in it.
I feel voters, residents — it does not matter what aspect of the political spectrum you sit on — are sick of politicians who do stuff simply to get re-elected. They need individuals to do what they imagine is correct, and I imagine that is proper. If we do not get re-elected due to it, I can personally maintain my head up excessive and say, “You already know what? We caught to our values and we did what’s proper.” If it really works out, nice. I really assume it should work out, although.
It looks as if a progressive metropolis like Vancouver — the primary metropolis in Canada to have a Bitcoin ATM — must be in favor of Bitcoin. Nonetheless, the earlier mayor tried to ban Bitcoin ATMs within the metropolis. Was there a response from the Vancouver neighborhood when the mayor did this?
I did not observe it too carefully on the time, so I do not know. I can not touch upon it. What I can touch upon is we do have a number of politicians who will make coverage up based mostly on advantage signaling versus information. We’re an information pushed administration, and we care concerning the future prosperity of our metropolis.
I feel the excellence right here is we select to have essentially the most influence — we’re extra involved concerning the steak than the sizzle. If somebody could make an argument on why it is a dangerous concept based mostly on information, we’ll hearken to it. We would have it improper, however I can let you know nobody has been capable of assault our Bitcoin stance with information.
Bitcoin could be sort of tough to make use of technically. So, to illustrate, in an ideal world, possibly Bitcoin turns into authorized tender in Vancouver sooner or later, or if there’s simply larger adoption of it, do you are concerned concerning the technical difficulties related to utilizing Bitcoin? Would the Vancouver metropolis authorities ever become involved in educating its Vancouver residents about Bitcoin?
It is not one of many core providers we offer as a metropolis, so I do not see us happening the academic rabbit gap. We’ll go away it as much as different specialists.
If the trade makes Bitcoin easier to make use of, so many extra teams and people will simply hop on the bandwagon. And you understand it is coming as a result of there are lots of people engaged on this proper now.
I am not an professional, however once I, once I hear about among the issues which can be occurring on Layer 2s and the Lightning Community, I see a future the place that is seamless. When individuals go right into a Walgreens they usually purchase a sweet bar, they received’t take into consideration how they’re paying with Bitcoin. All of the plumbing beneath will occur with out them understanding, and it should revolutionize the planet.
You’ve got executed a handful of interviews on this matter to this point. Is there something that we within the media haven’t requested you but that you simply’d like to debate or level out?
Sure, I’d wish to make a normal name out and never only for the town of Vancouver. It is for each single metropolis and province and state and jurisdiction and canton, and nation on the planet.
We’ve to get the training on the market, which continues to be a tough problem. Some individuals within the media have made the remark that what we’re doing proper now could be extra advantage signaling, as a result of we’ve the hope of constructing this occur. That is incorrect, although.
We want Bitcoin supporters to begin pumping the true narrative of why bitcoin is a sound monetary asset. It is the very best performing asset within the final 16 years on the planet. And we’re not merchants, so should you’re not trying to day commerce, all the volatility does not matter.
We have to begin getting that narrative out, however not from me, from the neighborhood. We have to let our elected officers know this as a result of they don’t seem to be going to do something till individuals hit them with information and inform our legislators that they need this.
We’re doing this as a result of we imagine in it. We wish to get forward of it. We wish to arrange the town for the subsequent 100 years, and that is why we’re prepared to take political threat to do that. However we’d like assist. So, in case your viewers can assist us push that narrative with our provincial authorities and of their jurisdictions, as effectively, that may be nice.
If individuals come onboard and see how bitcoin can scale back among the monetary stress of their lives, do you assume Vancouver transforms right into a pro-Bitcoin metropolis comparatively shortly?
Sure.
I’m going again to my sister-in-law, who if she watches the video she’s gonna punch me within the face. About 13 years in the past, she was afraid of getting an iPhone. She did not perceive the expertise. It was a psychological block.
Then, she jumped on the bandwagon like everybody else, as a result of all her buddies had iPhones. It is ridiculous now to assume that individuals had been afraid of iPhones, proper?
Will Bitcoin give us hope? Completely.
I’m going again to the Metropolis of Vancouver and why that is so vital. The Metropolis of Vancouver exists in the identical situations as everybody else does. Whereas individuals cannot afford a house or they’re combating groceries, we’ve a price range.
We’ve to rent cops, firefighters, engineers, and we’re dwelling in an setting the place our foreign money is getting debased and we won’t improve taxes at a price that retains up with that. We do not wish to reduce providers, and so Bitcoin provides us hope the place we will repair our monetary state, our stability sheet.
And that may really assist us run this metropolis for the subsequent hundred years. I feel when individuals perceive Bitcoin they usually begin to undertake it, they may have hope, as effectively, as a result of they may understand their buying energy goes up, which is a good factor.
